Benchwork Question

[Saturnalia]

I'm nearing the stage where it will be time to set up benchwork for my planned layout. I've got my trackplan, and a diagram of the planned surface, but not the sub-structure under the plywood.

My layout plan is an "L" shaped shelf layout that is 9ft by 6ft, with a dogleg on each end that are 2ft by 2ft, and the corner is also a 2ft by 2ft area. The rest is all set to be 1ft wide.

As a general project requirement, I cannot greatly disturb the floor (which is carpeted) or the wall to the point that it would have to have a bunch of repairs if/when we move.

In light of the above, I'm thinking that I'm gonna have to go with some sort of shelving method. I've got a general idea, but I'd really like it if some more experianced modelers looked it over first, especially since I've never seen one done this sort of way before, I've only seen the 2x4 ground-supported structures that many of you guys use.

My plan is to use heavy duty steel (or the like) L brackets, screwed into the studs (it would be just about every stud), then 1x4 on top of those, and then 3/4 inch plywood as the main base.

My main concern is if the design would be adequately stable for a layout (little warping, very stable).
Should I use thicker plywood? Should I use a different kind of bracket, such as a triangle?

Anything you see as a problem please point out!

Thanks!

[Big Frank]

THe only bench i need involves working out and plenty of heavy steel plates hahahaha

[Proto48Patrick]

what you're doing is pretty 'lite weight". N Scale I presume. Do you plan on having bridges and hills: Grade above and below the main elevation? Or is everything going to be table top?

[AARR]

Holy cow MQT. Ive been teased that my benchwork can support a car engine but I think yours will support the whole car and Big Franks workout bench

I think your design will accomplish your goals. I wouldn't go any heavy-dutier.

[Ypsi]

Sounds like it should work out, maybe a leg on each end of your "L" shape for extra support... And maybe one in the corner just for kicks. Rather be safe then sorry I guess

[Saturnalia]

what you're doing is pretty 'lite weight". N Scale I presume. Do you plan on having bridges and hills: Grade above and below the main elevation? Or is everything going to be table top?

Everything will be pretty flat on a table top design...origionally I was going to have a double-decker design, but I scrapped that for numerous, including size and cost.....

and "Heavy Duty" is not indsutrial....just above the norm for a normal shelving unit


I think the design will allow for easy wiring too. I hope to have a full diagram up by the weekend. I got some terminal jointers when I got my track (2 big lots off Ebay for less that $200 total! SCORE).

I'm basically building it so it can be moved/stored over time.


As far as scenery goes, I'm gonna take it one step at a time. I have a picture in my mind, but it could be a couple years before the secenery is done. Picture a sand dune/hilly type theme. There will be some tunnels. Most of the industry will be mining-related...

[AC60CW]

I don't use plywood on top of my framework. I put 1 1/2" foamboard. Combined with the frame it provides a very rigid setup. Greatly reducing the weight as well. I used 1x4's as well.


11234_171929293639_588348639_2845061_73311_n by ac60cw, on Flickr

This shows better. I just used Liquid Nails for Projects to adhere to the wood. The thick foamboard also allows you to go slightly down in elevation for things such as ditches without worries.

[Todd Cline]

Like AC said. If you are worried about the weight of the layout compressing your carpet, I would do the metal stud framework with a pink/or/blue foam base. Depending on where you go, ( I'd try Menards first). sometimes those galvanized sheetmetal studs are cheaper than the equivilant wood 2X4. This construction leads to a much louder layout though, wood/homasote is the best sound insulator, but it is very heavy. Of course, the obvious thing to prevent carpet damage is to install "Big Feet" on your supports. A 6"x6" square of 1/2" plywood at the bottom of any legs will go a long way towards preventing any permanent divots in your carpet. edit:
I just reread your original question and I think we all got a bit off topic here. You are going to fasten most of your layout to the wall correct? If so, you need to provide angled supports to the lowest point on the wall coinciding with your vertical braces. For your wider sections, (2 ft. I believe), you might be able to do a double angle to the low point and not have any legs on the floor at all if you use lightweight construction. Just be sure you are putting your anchor points into studs, not the drywall. ( if you have drywall in the area in question). Without more detailed description of your layout room, and what you want to build, that's about all I can suggest up to this point.

Todd

[Todd Cline]

Are we dealing with a rental place where we cant do a lot of drilling/modifications, or are you just trying to keep the footprint to a minimum? Two entirely different game plans here depending on the situation. I know, I've done both.

Todd

[Saturnalia]

The room is a finished basement room, and SHOULD have studs, but I guess it might be Concrete wall closely behind at that point. It is our house, we can do whatever we want, it's my parents who want minimal impact.

Basically the idea is to have a layout that is semi-permenant, and could realistically be moved and re-installed in any room where there is enough wall space.

I'm gonna have to get to Home Depot or another store like that and check out what the have for brackets.....maybe I'll just get a bigger bracket for the wider areas....

[GreatLakesRailfan]

I'm gonna have to get to Home Depot or another store like that and check out what the have for brackets.....maybe I'll just get a bigger bracket for the wider areas....

Check out Menards, like Todd said. They have quite a bit of shelving stuff, including lots of different shelving brackets.

For my recent layout building projects I was picking up stuff at Home Depot as I needed it (the closest Menards is about an hour's drive, one way), but I had some extra time one day and drove over to Menards. I wound up finding quite a bit of stuff that was either a lot cheaper than locally, or that the local stores simply didn't carry. Plus, for the most part, the service is quite a bit better there than most other places, which helps a lot if you're not quite sure what you're looking for, or what you need.

[Y@]

I'm gonna have to get to Home Depot or another store like that and check out what the have for brackets.....maybe I'll just get a bigger bracket for the wider areas....

Check out Menards, like Todd said. They have quite a bit of shelving stuff, including lots of different shelving brackets.

For my recent layout building projects I was picking up stuff at Home Depot as I needed it (the closest Menards is about an hour's drive, one way), but I had some extra time one day and drove over to Menards. I wound up finding quite a bit of stuff that was either a lot cheaper than locally, or that the local stores simply didn't carry. Plus, for the most part, the service is quite a bit better there than most other places, which helps a lot if you're not quite sure what you're looking for, or what you need.

I'll second what he said, Menards is generally a much nicer place to go than Home Depot. Home Depot seems to employ a lot more idiots than Menards.

[AC60CW]

Ok, so mounting to the wall. This was how I did mine. In the basement and against bare block walls.


11234_171929228639_588348639_2845053_2399951_n by ac60cw, on Flickr

The 2x4's against the wall also serve as the base for my backdrop as well. Take what you want from it or none. I found it to have a very low impact to the room. This method offers a great deal of rigidity to the final product. I built sections of 8'x2' frames with the 1x4's. This allows the benchwork to easily taken apart and moved in the future, if needed.

[CSX_CO]

When I did my benchwork, Menards was selling angle brackets for a couple bucks a piece. I used 2x4 for the braces the angle brackets attached to, and 1x4 for the front, back, and any additional support boards. I used a stud finder to find the studs, and put 1x2 in strips over the studs. This serves as a place to mount the hardboard back drop too. In the event I move, I'll just have to unscrew everything, and patch the holes with some plaster. Valence for lighting attaches to these also, and will be 2x4 braces, with 1x4 end board. For my peninsula, I made it out of 2x4, with 2x4 end posts cut to length to fit just clear of the ceiling.

Practice Safe CSX

[Saturnalia]

The other day while helping my parents move around some junk in the storage room, I came across 8 steel shelving brackets (2ft long each) AND 2 7ft by 2ft sections of 3/4 in particle board. These were at one point shelving back in the storage room, but dad took them down years ago for another type of shelving. These brackets are the kind that have a track-type hanging system (think like at supermarkets) where the cantilevers have hooks that go into pre-drilled slots in the track, which is positioned over the studs. My parents had forgotten about them, and they were hidden behind 2 queen matresses! (Our storage area is like the family storage area....there's stuff from everyone down there lol).

Anyway, so I had to scrap my origional plan and instead I'm going to end up with a shelf layout that is 12ft by 2ft, plus a 2ft by 2ft "L". Because of the extra width, I'm going to do some elevation in the track engineering. I'll put some foamboard over the 3/4 in Plywood. Is there a thinkness anyone would recommend? It's N-scale, and I plan on having tunnels and such, so clearance is a slight issue....would 1 inch be enough? Or maybe 1.25in? 1.5in?

Thanks for your help

[AC60CW]

I would think 1 inch would be more than fine. The nice thing I found with using the foam board is that you can easily cut down into the board to make river beds without having to raise your track level at all. If you are going to or think you might sometime in the future want to have rivers. Take this into account with the thickness. If you are going to have then without a bridge over the water, then no worries.

[bctrainfan]

FYI, I have had a problem with particle board shelving sagging due to high humidity in my sometimes damp basement. Now these were storage shelves with a fairly heavy load. A layout is not going to be that heavy, and if its somewhere nice and dry, probably be OK. On the other hand, if my math is right, your plan would only require one 4x8 sheet of good plywood.

[Saturnalia]

FYI, I have had a problem with particle board shelving sagging due to high humidity in my sometimes damp basement. Now these were storage shelves with a fairly heavy load. A layout is not going to be that heavy, and if its somewhere nice and dry, probably be OK. On the other hand, if my math is right, your plan would only require one 4x8 sheet of good plywood.

I've already got the plywood...it was the old shelves for the shelving brackets

[GrandTrunkFan]

I agree with AC60CW, Ive built my Greenville module like his layout. Only difference is I used 1x3s. I put 2 in foam board on the top and its light and sturdy. Doesnt need to be mounted to the wall, and can travel and be moved like furniture.

[Saturnalia]

Would it work to have 2 layers of foam board? I ask because my layout will have two distinct levels, and I'd like a bit of a lake on the lower level, but not have to level the cutout areas. I was thinking like a 1/2 inch lower level, and then a 1-inch on top of that? Also, what type of adhesive should I use to bond the foamboard to the wood, foamboard to foamboard, and foamboard to cork roadbed?