Napoleon, Defiance and Western: The Definitive Thread

[railohio]

ND&W just arrived in Napoleon with a black Geep and a bunch of boxcars.

And I also have the distinction of making the 1,000th reply to the thread. Go me.

[ns8401]

Saw the ND&W westbound near Cecil on Thursday. Had a black Geep; covered hopper; four Golden West boxcars; and two empty tank cars, one each with 1992 and 1993 placards. At the same time there was an eastbound train from Cecil, but I did not see the consist. There were also about 10 brown boxcars on the interchange in Woodburn, but I did not see if loaded or empty.

1992 = Glycerine
1993 = Diesel Fuel, Fuel Oil, N.O.S

[DelayInBlock]

Last Thursday:

[MQT1223]

Last Thursday:

Call me crazy but that looks pretty good compared to when the MAW was in control. I am seeing new ties and ballast. All baby steps to bringing the line back up to a good standing. I would say that the day the speed limit gets raised from 10 to 15 mph Pioneer could say their finally winning the battle. Of course who knows how far they really want to take the line. If business keeps growing they can only get better!

[AARR]

Call me crazy but that looks pretty good compared to when the MAW was in control. I am seeing new ties and ballast. All baby steps to bringing the line back up to a good standing. I would say that the day the speed limit gets raised from 10 to 15 mph Pioneer could say their finally winning the battle. Of course who knows how far they really want to take the line. If business keeps growing they can only get better!

Enjoyed the video, DIB.

I don't think they need to go faster. It's 15 miles from Defiance to Napoleon. Just staying on the track the whole trip consistently is probably fine for that part of the operation.

[MQT1223]

Call me crazy but that looks pretty good compared to when the MAW was in control. I am seeing new ties and ballast. All baby steps to bringing the line back up to a good standing. I would say that the day the speed limit gets raised from 10 to 15 mph Pioneer could say their finally winning the battle. Of course who knows how far they really want to take the line. If business keeps growing they can only get better!

Enjoyed the video, DIB.

I don't think they need to go faster. It's 15 miles from Defiance to Napoleon. Just staying on the track the whole trip consistently is probably fine for that part of the operation.

But isn't their 50 miles of track that is trying to be rehabbed for operation? I know some of it is in operation and some isn't because of lost business on the old MAW but I know business is improving.

[Standard Railfan]

Last Thursday:

The condition of the track and the light blue on the end of the last box caused me to think of the Rock Island in the era of freights derailing in yards. While standing still.

[Super Chief]

You would have thought the engineer would have bailed out when he saw the speeder trailer flipped over.

[Bulby]

Pioneer is winning the battle if you actually get down to the hard numbers.

You don't really have to go much more than 10mph to serve customers well on this line. Just so you are consistent and not spilling cargo everywhere.

[jrgerber]

Here are some general questions, how many ties are there to a mile of railroad track? What is the cost of a new hardwood treated tie and the cost to install one?

So lets say I own a shortline and I want to replace my beat up twisted rail. I'm sure I can't afford to go to a steel mill and say I would like a new mile of rail, that's probably cost prohibitive. So what does it cost to purchase a mile of used rail lets say 80-100 pound? and who supplies used rail?

What does it cost in running condition lets medium condition to purchase a GP7? GP16? GP10? GP9? I'm just looking for a range. I assume the used locomotive market is tight right now.

[Saturnalia]

Here are some general questions, how many ties are there to a mile of railroad track? What is the cost of a new hardwood treated tie and the cost to install one?

I'd also wonder what the cost of previously-used ties are. I know for instance that the Coopersville & Marne uses re-laid ties discarded by the Class Is...they tend to be in decent shape so I wonder if that you be a plausible notion in contrast to more expensive new ties, given the context here?

[jrgerber]

I do recall that Pioneer got a great deal on those GP-16s back in the day I think they went for $30-$35 k per engine. My recollection is that they paid about $68-$75k for those BNSF GP-20s.

[Ypsi]

Here are some general questions, how many ties are there to a mile of railroad track? What is the cost of a new hardwood treated tie and the cost to install one?

I'd also wonder what the cost of previously-used ties are. I know for instance that the Coopersville & Marne uses re-laid ties discarded by the Class Is...they tend to be in decent shape so I wonder if that you be a plausible notion in contrast to more expensive new ties, given the context here?

I know that in some cases Class 1's will give away their ties if someone from the group can haul them, and then write them off of their taxes.

I would assume that if you wanted to you can buy used ties directly from a class 1, but heck there's places all around that have hundreds of ties for sale (as well as a couple bundles by the depot with a for sale sign on them currently). I think they are $5-10 a pop from the place in Milan.. I guess its more based on how many you need (think landscapers, ect). I am pretty sure that they get their ties by just hauling them away from the ROW for the RR, as this summer they took a bunch from outside my house along the ROW with a truck that I later saw at the tie place listed below in Milan.
http://annarbor.craigslist.org/grd/4668978840.html

[CSX_CO]

I'd also wonder what the cost of previously-used ties are. I know for instance that the Coopersville & Marne uses re-laid ties discarded by the Class Is...they tend to be in decent shape so I wonder if that you be a plausible notion in contrast to more expensive new ties, given the context here?

I know that in some cases Class 1's will give away their ties if someone from the group can haul them, and then write them off of their taxes. [/quote]

Not to get off track, but there is some money to be made in scrap ties. CSX contracts out tie recycling. The good ties are graded and sold. Ones suitable for relay on another railroad would fetch a higher price than say landscape timbers. Even the broken ones get recycled and burned in power plants to produce power. The ties on the ROW are owned by someone, and we usually get calls from the local police departments after tie projects where they catch someone stealing from the piles of ties waiting for sorting at the crossings.

Practice Safe CSX

[AARR]

Not to get off track

A pun

but there is some money to be made in scrap ties. CSX contracts out tie recycling. The good ties are graded and sold. Ones suitable for relay on another railroad would fetch a higher price than say landscape timbers. Even the broken ones get recycled and burned in power plants to produce power. The ties on the ROW are owned by someone, and we usually get calls from the local police departments after tie projects where they catch someone stealing from the piles of ties waiting for sorting at the crossings.

The power plant in McBain, MI is getting many carloads of used ties by rail (GLC). I've heard some of the ties are in decent enough shape for a short line but to date I think they all end up being burned.

[alittlevanwerty]

When the CF&E did their Delphos to American twp tie project they had roll offs brought in and sent it all to the landfill.

[h2466]

Here are some general questions, how many ties are there to a mile of railroad track? What is the cost of a new hardwood treated tie and the cost to install one?

3000 to 3300 depending on what class your operating. Cost per tie? Again it depends on quantity and quality of the ties you need. Relay rail is priced by the ton so there are allot of variables to figure in. 90# pound rail is going for around $400 a stick. Ken

[MQT1223]

Not to get off track

A pun

but there is some money to be made in scrap ties. CSX contracts out tie recycling. The good ties are graded and sold. Ones suitable for relay on another railroad would fetch a higher price than say landscape timbers. Even the broken ones get recycled and burned in power plants to produce power. The ties on the ROW are owned by someone, and we usually get calls from the local police departments after tie projects where they catch someone stealing from the piles of ties waiting for sorting at the crossings.

The power plant in McBain, MI is getting many carloads of used ties by rail (GLC). I've heard some of the ties are in decent enough shape for a short line but to date I think they all end up being burned.

Aren't those things kinda difficult to burn with the preservatives and stuff in them from locomotives dripping stuff?

[jrgerber]

90# pound rail is going for around $400 a stick. Ken

Thanks Ken and a stick is how many feet long?

[jrgerber]

My guess is that a used GP-16 or GP-7 in runnable condition (blue carded I think is the term?) would run about $125,000-$175,000 per? Close or way off?