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Does the .9 in 13.9 mean they can only run 13 trains or is it 14 trains and no more? Seems like such a weird number when you could just say 13 or 14.. Unless it has to do with some sort of weekly, monthly, or yearly average.

YpsiAmtrakBoy wrote:some sort of weekly, monthly, or yearly average.

There you go.

How did people in Lakewood and Rocky River deal with NKP's fast freights with berks and black and gold diesels on the head end charging through the suburbs with the trains at top spend and whistles and air horns full blast at those 33 crossings? Or when NS ran these through Lakewood at top speed in the 90s..
http://www.morscher.com/rr/1997/19970615_01.jpg
http://www.morscher.com/rr/1996/19960803_05.jpg

Was anybody ever hurt or killed at those 33 grade crossings or was woken up out of bed at three in the morning in the 70 years prior to 1998? I guess people just dealt with it.

Mayor Summers Shares Concerns Over Increased Train Traffic In Lakewood

Mayor Michael Summers has reached out to the Ohio Rail Development Commission, Norfolk Southern and neighboring communities to voice his concerns about the railroad’s plan to triple train traffic through Lakewood and other Westshore communities.

Residents should expect a rise in rail traffic soon, and some may have already noticed an increase. Norfolk Southern has informed Lakewood that “increased rail traffic and congestion” will result in four more trains coming through Lakewood each day.

Source: http://lakewoodobserver.com/read/2014/1 ... n-lakewood

K guys from what I've read just now in Railroads Illustrated...(oops) Railfan & Railroad March edition..The reroutes through Lakewood, Rocky River, Lorain etc...have already commenced to relieve the congestion. Trains 145, 15K, 309, and 310 along with 14T are back running on the ex NKP Cleveland District...And the drawbridge in Lorain is now back to being fully staffed 24 hours..I need to hang out near this place. These are just the trains so far...And there also plans 170 miles up the shore in Buffalo for new connections, a double tracking project, and expansion of Bison Yard..How on earth is 15K being rerouted through here from Conway?

Is this increase here to stay? Does it happen to mention the train count per day?

bluestreak81 wrote:Is this increase here to stay? Does it happen to mention the train count per day?

Those four were mentioned along with 14T and some coal trains. I don't think well be seeing pre 1999 merger levels of 20 trains a day anytime soon but look for a gradual increase over time.

Do you see this line being a viable resource for many years to come? It's been through some up and downs since the merger and Lakefront Bypass. Once, there was talk of abandonment in 2003 (http://www.hotelbruce.com/01_01/bruceblog_7-7.php), and even adding commuter rail service on this line from Cleveland to as far west as Sandusky due to the low freight traffic.

bluestreak81 wrote:Do you see this line being a viable resource for many years to come? It's been through some up and downs since the merger and Lakefront Bypass. Once, there was talk of abandonment in 2003 (http://www.hotelbruce.com/01_01/bruceblog_7-7.php), and even adding commuter rail service on this line from Cleveland to as far west as Sandusky due to the low freight traffic.

Indeed it has...The Nickel Plate has nine lives...It could've went the way of the 19Th street trackage in Erie..The two mile stretch of street running that has condos built on the ROW near the big viaduct by the Bayfront Connector and over at CP Cascade, truck trailers occupy the lot where the Bessemer interchanged with the line. In 1986 NS wanted to tie in with Conrail and abandon the entire east end of Cleveland District from Cleveland eastward. So yeah the line is here to stay...And as for light rail transit and commuter, maybe they can look to I90 for a light rail line..It amazing how a line like the Erie Lackawanna died overnight a cruel death yet the NKP has been given chance after chance after chance...Murrica

It is good to see NS making all these moves to make their system able to handle more traffic and not putting all the eggs in one basket. CSX??????

bluestreak81 wrote:and even adding commuter rail service on this line from Cleveland to as far west as Sandusky due to the low freight traffic.

Sandusky seems a bit too far west, especially considering the NKP doesn't go through there. Perhaps it was Vermilion you're thinking of?

howeld wrote:It is good to see NS making all these moves to make their system able to handle more traffic and not putting all the eggs in one basket. CSX??????

Of course NS isn't putting their eggs all in one basket. Though, let me ask you, what do the former NYC, PRR (which they're using), and NKP all have in common? Their western end is still Chicago.

Meanwhile, CSX is routing traffic via new connection at Smithboro, IL to the BNSF to bypass Chicago, working with the UP to route freight via St. Louis to get around Chicago, etc.

Just because you don't see CSX needing THREE lines between Chicago and the east, doesn't mean CSX isn't doing something to move traffic off the line and away from Chicago. I'm seeing more traffic for the CN at Chicago (Kirk Yard traffic) being interchanged at Effingham to keep it from having to try and be interchanged up in the City.

If anything, it appears to this observer, that NS IS putting all their eggs in one basket by trying to cram everything into Bellevue, and then trying to keep running all their traffic into Chicago. It is still the 10 lbs of stuff into an 8 lbs bag for the NS, they're just trying to do 6 lbs on the NYC, 3 lbs on the NKP, and 1 lbs on the PRR and thinking that equals 8 lbs.

But hey...what do I know?

Practice Safe CSX

CSX_CO wrote:

howeld wrote:It is good to see NS making all these moves to make their system able to handle more traffic and not putting all the eggs in one basket. CSX??????

Of course NS isn't putting their eggs all in one basket. Though, let me ask you, what do the former NYC, PRR (which they're using), and NKP all have in common? Their western end is still Chicago.

Meanwhile, CSX is routing traffic via new connection at Smithboro, IL to the BNSF to bypass Chicago, working with the UP to route freight via St. Louis to get around Chicago, etc.

Just because you don't see CSX needing THREE lines between Chicago and the east, doesn't mean CSX isn't doing something to move traffic off the line and away from Chicago. I'm seeing more traffic for the CN at Chicago (Kirk Yard traffic) being interchanged at Effingham to keep it from having to try and be interchanged up in the City.

If anything, it appears to this observer, that NS IS putting all their eggs in one basket by trying to cram everything into Bellevue, and then trying to keep running all their traffic into Chicago. It is still the 10 lbs of stuff into an 8 lbs bag for the NS, they're just trying to do 6 lbs on the NYC, 3 lbs on the NKP, and 1 lbs on the PRR and thinking that equals 8 lbs.

But hey...what do I know?

Practice Safe CSX

I don't disagree with you at all. Bypassing Chicago is a good idea. I was thinking more along the lines of a major derailment that takes the line out for a few days. The C&O in WV will have been closed over a week due to the oil train derailment. If CSX had a similar mess somewhere between Chicago and Willard their options would be limited. Send a few on NS and a few up to Michigan. Try to cram more through Avon which is already full. Where will the other 60 or more trains go?

Do you think the same snake oil selling consultant that sold NS on auto dispatch got them to make Bellevue into a hub like UPS and FedEx does with air freight? I mean routing a car loaded in Alabama and headed to Tennessee several hundred miles out of the way to Bellevue and back makes tons of operational sense......

CSX_CO wrote:

howeld wrote:It is good to see NS making all these moves to make their system able to handle more traffic and not putting all the eggs in one basket. CSX??????

Of course NS isn't putting their eggs all in one basket. Though, let me ask you, what do the former NYC, PRR (which they're using), and NKP all have in common? Their western end is still Chicago.

Meanwhile, CSX is routing traffic via new connection at Smithboro, IL to the BNSF to bypass Chicago, working with the UP to route freight via St. Louis to get around Chicago, etc.

Just because you don't see CSX needing THREE lines between Chicago and the east, doesn't mean CSX isn't doing something to move traffic off the line and away from Chicago. I'm seeing more traffic for the CN at Chicago (Kirk Yard traffic) being interchanged at Effingham to keep it from having to try and be interchanged up in the City.

If anything, it appears to this observer, that NS IS putting all their eggs in one basket by trying to cram everything into Bellevue, and then trying to keep running all their traffic into Chicago. It is still the 10 lbs of stuff into an 8 lbs bag for the NS, they're just trying to do 6 lbs on the NYC, 3 lbs on the NKP, and 1 lbs on the PRR and thinking that equals 8 lbs.

But hey...what do I know?

Practice Safe CSX

NS is now operating a new train 20J from Buffalo to Chicago. Along with two other intermodals 26R and 27R a pair of Toledo-Buffalo trains and you can now throw in an oil train as well. That one goes to Binghamton but have no idea where it goes after that. This is between Cleveland and Buffalo but trains 20R and 25R are still traveling the NKP from Vermilion to Chicago as well as 21R which operates once a week.

Has the train traffic remained high on this line?

bluestreak81 wrote:Has the train traffic remained high on this line?

Judging from the some pictures I've seen taken on some of the facebook groups from the Lakewood, Rocky River and Bay Village I'd say so. Pictures have been popping up during the day of trains on the Cleveland District. And the drawbridge in Lorain is still staffed 24/7, I spent this and last weekend in the Bellevue-Huron-Avery-Shinrock and Vermilion areas and train activity was very brisk. There is a new train L13 that operates from Bellevue to Rockport and back and that has replaced 363 or whatever it was that was Bellevue- Cleveland turn.

bluestreak81 wrote:Has the train traffic remained high on this line?

Not apparent to me. I was at Vermilion Saturday June 20 from 7am to 4pm and out of the 36 I had, only one was straight NKP.

bdconrail29 wrote:

bluestreak81 wrote:Has the train traffic remained high on this line?

Not apparent to me. I was at Vermilion Saturday June 20 from 7am to 4pm and out of the 36 I had, only one was straight NKP.

What time do 20R, 20Q, 206, 24Z, and 22K come through the Chicago Line? I only saw 24M and 20E, and please do a trip-reports of your Vermillion, I always read your trip reports, they help me out

Redside20: What are the Facebook groups called? I would love to see the photos of the line.