Amtrak threatens to move their Heavy Repair facility

[CSX_CO]

All public roads cost the taxpayers money. The toll road returned money to the state. Getting a lump sum pre-payment was a good deal. But if you bothered to read more about it you would find articles that question the deal over the long term. The toll road lease is 75 years. That is a long time to give up the annual revenue. What will happen when the lump sum is gone?

Again, did you READ the articles? Tell me how losing money "3 out of the last 5 years before the lease" 'brought money to the state'? Please, show me in what math that an annual 'loss' equals profit to the rest of the state?

Maybe I need to repost this article, since you apparently missed it the first time around:

http://www.elkharttruth.com/article/201 ... source=RSS

Then there’s the “sorry history” of 50-plus years when the toll road “was under political management,” Woodruff adds. Under state control, the toll road never became debt free and it lost money in three of the last five years it was publicly operated, including a $16 million loss in 2005.

“Prior to the lease, the road had generated a total of only $254 million for other purposes over its entire history,” notes Woodruff.

Again, over the FIFTY YEAR history of the Toll Road, they only ever generated $254 million in "profit". That's a paltry $5.8 million dollar AVERAGE for 'profit' per year, 50 years. Again, the lease generated $3.8 BILLION. If Indiana saw $5.8 Million average 'profit' (that's not every year mind you), it would only take 703 years to get the $3.8 billion the state got in one pen swipe. I'm sorry, where was the downside again?

Ok, great, they generated $90 million in Revenue on toll collection. If Expenses > Revenue = LOSS.

This whole toll road issue was brought up as an example of the difference between private contractor operation vs public government operation, so perhaps you can focus on that issue? It isn't about how whether the lease of the toll road was good for the state or not ... it is about whether having ITC run the toll road is better than ITR. And if you can somehow apply your opinion to the actual subject of this thread (Beech Grove) it would be good.

Despite the tangent in conversation I've tried to apply my opinion to Beach Grove. Go therefore and do likewise.

Ok, letsee that connection...

But I digress ...

As far as the threat to lose Beech Grove it is not the same thing. It is not INDOT turning over railcar maintenance to a foreign consortium.

WOW, what a great connection. Our point-counter point has done more to stimulate debate on public vs private funding. While a 'railroad' site, why does Transportation Policy matters have to be centered upon JUST railroads. CSX, NS, UP, BNSF aren't just 'railroad' companies after all...

Perhaps if a private entity runs the repair business for AMTRAK, they could 'save' on the expense of upkeep. Its obvious AMTRAK leeches money like a sieve. Its a "Government Entity". They have no accountability because they'll just keep going back to the till for more money. I'm not under the delusion that AMTRAK should turn a profit. Turning a profit on passenger operations alone is nigh impossible. The lease AMTRAK can do (along with any Government Agency) is be as 'careful' with MY money as possible. We're reaching a point in this country when the tax payers are starting to say 'enough' with the waste. Is AMTRAK waste? That debate could go either way...

I live in Indy. I work for the big railroad in town. I know people who work at the Grove at the shops. I understand they are good paying jobs. But to hold those jobs as political 'bait', to keep their shop train on, is a low ball tactic on AMTRAK's part. I'd be more willing to 'support' a subsidy if AMTRAK would just be honest about why they want to keep the Hoosier State on. They want it as a Hospital Train between Chicago and Indy, and want *someone else* to pay for it. Fine, whatever. I *get* that. Call it what it is, another handout to keep their operation afloat. Don't try and put lipstick on the pig and say that "Well, if we don't get this, we're cutting the Grove." I don't know AMTRAK's mechanical capabilities, but I highly doubt they have the money to build a new shop, or have other shops absorb the work. AMTRAK has proven their commitment to "The Grove" when the Hoosier State was cut off in the past.

AMTRAK is just pissy that someone else isn't going to be paying the expense to run their shop train. AMTRAK has shown they don't 'value' the Cardinal nor the Hoosier State. I can remember when BOTH ran with Superliner equipment. Of course...you'd probably accuse me of imagining that, and attributing it to my 'failing memory'. Now...it runs with a couple Horizon or Amfleet coaches. No food service (that I'm aware of). They've even moved up the evening departure to 5:45 central. It used to be one of the later departures allowing for a full day in the city. Its a shop shuttle that AMTRAK just happens to have a couple hot coaches on.

Practice Safe CSX

[slwapprslw]

Amtrak wasting money? Here's how government entities work: You don't get rewarded for being frugal. You spend all the money or you will not get the same amount of money for the next year. If you use less money in a year (aka save money), you receive less money the next year. Congress views saving money as less of a need for it the next year. It is a vicious cycle that affects all government agencies. The taxpayers view as a waste, but many don't understand how the cycle works. Until the people and the government change the cycle, it will continue to repeat itself year after year. So, Amtrak will always have the spend it or lose it attitude until things change.

[Huelsy'sTrainBlog]

My two cents: At work I pay for my lunch but once a week in a meeting I get a free lunch. I don't mind buying my lunch but I will take the free one any time! So if Amtrak can get a "free lunch" or in their case a free hospital train, more power to them.

[CSX_CO]

"No such thing as a free lunch."~unknown

Practice Safe CSX

[NSSD60M]

No, not everyone is a dumba$$ and way down on the totem pole of intelligence when compared to yourself.

Your right, not everyone is, nor have I ever said they are. I do know someone on this board that is.....He is WAY down on the totem pole, and he seems to like NS SD60s.....


I will deal with this whole thing later, it is time to go to bed so I am rested for my FIRST shift job....


EDIT.

You know what, I will let the stupid statements posted by someone stand on their own without any further comment. Read the links that I posted from professionals and their opinion on the toll road deal, while the low man on the totem pole rants about the mowing of grass....

Good to see a real winner chime in while simultaneously going through life with blinders on.
I really wish we still ran on the B&O.. could make for some added irritations. Wouldn't mind requalifying for that stretch of rail if it did ever reestablish as an Amtrak route (not likely.) But then again, at my age, I'd just simply like to thank you as a taxpayer for nearly 40 years of employment, and an impending retirement Thanks Typhoon, for being so gracious, it's appreciated!
At any rate, the whole toll road discussion going on here I must take credit for, and there have been some good viewpoints discussed I see. Nice that everyone has kept it at an adult level of intelliegence, well, despite one that we couldn't expect that from. Justalurker and CSX CO, I enjoy what you have both contributed. I didn't mean to lead off from the main topic here though. I was just using it to illustrate what could happen.
And yes, an NSSD60M would rank as my favorite motor ever operated. Had one lending a hand at one point, when I was in CZ service, ironically.