CSX Porter Branch

[MQT1223]

Anyone have an idea on what CSX runs on the Porter branch? I know it’s not a lot, but after checking out the diamond at Portage where it crosses the Garrett Sub and seeing the connection with the branch I figured maybe there might be an additional train or two that doesn’t run up to Porter and instead takes the branch up or down to Portage?

[SD80MAC]

The only train CSX runs up to Porter is a local that works the steel distributor south of the NS. That's the only CSX train that runs north of Willow Creek, everything else are trains to and from the NS.

[Saturnalia]

The only train CSX runs up to Porter is a local that works the steel distributor south of the NS. That's the only CSX train that runs north of Willow Creek, everything else are trains to and from the NS.

It's been a long time since I've seen NS send anything that way, and the rails are quite rusty - indicative of just the lite engine CSX sometimes sends up past 482 to complete a run-around.

I think the BNSF/NS shifted their interchange somewhere else, but I haven't read to where, or figured it out.

[MQT1223]

The only train CSX runs up to Porter is a local that works the steel distributor south of the NS. That's the only CSX train that runs north of Willow Creek, everything else are trains to and from the NS.

It's been a long time since I've seen NS send anything that way, and the rails are quite rusty - indicative of just the lite engine CSX sometimes sends up past 482 to complete a run-around.

I think the BNSF/NS shifted their interchange somewhere else, but I haven't read to where, or figured it out.

I happened to catch that move by sheer luck when I chased the 3194 to the end of the GR Sub. I never saw anything before or after that. I don't understand what CSX sees in this line. They can't even get to it without a time consuming reverse move off the GR Sub or using the connector at Portage.

[SD80MAC]

Historically, CSX and NS (and Conrail before either of them) have utilized the Porter Branch for trains going to the IHB, as it provides a more direct route to Gibson Yard. NS also would utilize the full length of the line all the way to Streator, IL by way of Kankakee, for a direct connection with BNSF.

[twropr]

I wish Amtrak and the state of IN would negotiate a deal with NS to persuade them to route all trains to/from the IHB and/or western connections with the Porter Branch so that there would not be so much congestion on the Chicago Line west of Porter delaying Amtrak. IN did not get its money's worth a few years ago when it got an ARRA grant to add tracks and crossovers between Burns Harbor and Hammond, with the goal of making the line more fluid.
Andy

[Saturnalia]

IN did not get its money's worth a few years ago when it got an ARRA grant to add tracks and crossovers between Burns Harbor and Hammond, with the goal of making the line more fluid.

They did for awhile. Then NS consolidated dispatchers to Atlanta - causing massive brain drain - and began relying on AutoRouter to lead dispatching decisions. The result: a railroad with fewer trains now runs like traffic doubled.

The dispatching system does not seem to care at all about Amtrak being higher priority, and it is common for them to get held up routinely when there are obvious holes that a skilled, seasoned dispatcher would be able to open up and slide them through.

[sd70accsxt700]

CSX runs M200, M353, B??? (Coal to ???), and the C600 series coal for Indiana Harbor. This is all south/west of Willow Creek. There is also Y1?? that a few times a week, at least runs to Willow Creek from East Chicago, shoves around the connection to the branch, and heads north with steel coil cars. If there is major congestion around Barr Yard or elsewhere, you will once in a great while get one of the I trains running the branch.

[NSSD70ACe]

The only train CSX runs up to Porter is a local that works the steel distributor south of the NS. That's the only CSX train that runs north of Willow Creek, everything else are trains to and from the NS.

It's been a long time since I've seen NS send anything that way, and the rails are quite rusty - indicative of just the lite engine CSX sometimes sends up past 482 to complete a run-around.

I think the BNSF/NS shifted their interchange somewhere else, but I haven't read to where, or figured it out.

NS/BNSF interchange for unit trains is Cicero. Same with CSX as far as I know. Believe CN is at Eola. Standard merch usually runs via the BRC to be reclassified or occasionally the NS will bring over what turns into an H-NSINTW and it goes to the twin cities.

Intermodal trains go through Ashland for NS, 71st Street for CSX. CSX is always an EB move, no WB.

[MiddleMI]

Sorry for bumping an old thread, but I had a question about something on the wiki page for this line:

CSX has considered putting in diamonds, but has held off for now (they use NS west of Porter to reach their Grand Rapids Subdivision). Thus CSX does not currently use the Porter Branch east of the junction at Willow Creek...

This kind of seemingly contradicts itself? So, they both don't use the line east of Willow Creek, but also use the NS West of Porter to access the GR Sub? As far as I can tell, that would mean they'd have to go northwest at Willow Creek all the way to CN Kirk Yard just to go east to get back to Porter and up the GR Sub. That can't be right, can it?

[justalurker66]

CSX from Grand Rapids exits at CP 497 Curtis Yard to reach the Barr Subdivision

[MiddleMI]

I still don't understand? Could you give a more detailed answer of the movements? I assume they use trackage right on some other railroad(s) for movements that need to access between these two branches and subdivisions, right?

[SD80MAC]

I still don't understand? Could you give a more detailed answer of the movements? I assume they use trackage right on some other railroad(s) for movements that need to access between these two branches and subdivisions, right?

While the Porter Branch and the Grand Rapids Sub are technically right across the NS mainline from each other at Porter, they do not connect. Any train wanting to go from one line to the other would require a back up move and crossing over 3 tracks. CSX Grand Rapids Sub trains take the NS from Porter (CP 482) to either East Curtis (CP 497) or Rock Island Junction (CP 509). There are no trains that use both the GR Sub and the Porter Branch, to put it simply.

At one time, there was talk of installing either a diamond or shifting the GR sub 1/2 mile east so that CSX trains to and from Grand Rapids could utilize the 482 crossovers to access the Porter Branch. This was 20+ years ago when the GR Sub was seeing 20+ trains a day. It wouldn't be worth the expense now.

[TSS]

I still don't understand? Could you give a more detailed answer of the movements? I assume they use trackage right on some other railroad(s) for movements that need to access between these two branches and subdivisions, right?

Porter branch yellow. GR sub blue.
NS Chicago Line Green. Amtrak Michigan red.
Physically, there’s no practical way to get from the GR sub to the Porter line. Only time I know it to have happened in the last decade was when they zig-zagged some work equipment across. Memory is fuzzy—it was a rail grinding train, I think.

[pudgy]

They also took a Geometry Train from the GR Sub to the Porter Branch a few years ago. Pretty much it otherwise.

[TSS]

They also took a Geometry Train from the GR Sub to the Porter Branch a few years ago. Pretty much it otherwise.

That’s what I was thinking of. Thanks for reminding me.

[chapmaja]

I still don't understand? Could you give a more detailed answer of the movements? I assume they use trackage right on some other railroad(s) for movements that need to access between these two branches and subdivisions, right?

While the Porter Branch and the Grand Rapids Sub are technically right across the NS mainline from each other at Porter, they do not connect. Any train wanting to go from one line to the other would require a back up move and crossing over 3 tracks. CSX Grand Rapids Sub trains take the NS from Porter (CP 482) to either East Curtis (CP 497) or Rock Island Junction (CP 509). There are no trains that use both the GR Sub and the Porter Branch, to put it simply.

At one time, there was talk of installing either a diamond or shifting the GR sub 1/2 mile east so that CSX trains to and from Grand Rapids could utilize the 482 crossovers to access the Porter Branch. This was 20+ years ago when the GR Sub was seeing 20+ trains a day. It wouldn't be worth the expense now.

I know you mentioned that there was talked about 20 years ago installing a diamond or moving the GR branch when it was busier. Even then, what would the advantage have been to use the Porter Branch rather than the current alignment of trains going to East Curtis or RI Jct? Just to avoid having to use the trackage rights over NS?

[SD80MAC]

Yes, being at the mercy of another railroad is usually something they try to avoid. Conrail was very busy and CSX trains would often spend hours at Porter or East Curtis waiting to get on the Chicago Line. Taking the Porter Branch to the B&O at Willow Creek would’ve eliminated that issue.

[justalurker66]

Has the traffic levels changed enough that a diamond would no longer be a benefit?

[Saturnalia]

Has the traffic levels changed enough that a diamond would no longer be a benefit?

Typically, only four trains per day would now use such a diamond. With JH Campbell Generating slated to close, that would be down to two.

Hard to justify triple diamond across 60-70 freight trains a day, especially in terms of maintenance, and NS' track speed through Chesterton.

It was a hard sell even when ~20 trains were going that way daily. NS would have to deal with a new diamond but at least not have to host those trains.