90s CSX Michigan Operations

[Racer]

I was curious to ask if there was any CSX trains in the 90s decade that worked both Grand Rapids and Lansing aside from Q326/Q327 and was there ever grain operations where road trains would work the grain elevators with swapping cars for loads/ empties aside from D708 or D709 or were the operations similiar to present day?

Also, does anyone have information on what CSX trains in the past ran through Plymouth to Grand Rapids and Plymouth to Saginaw?

[SD80MAC]

I think the GR-Saginaw trains were Q336 and Q337.

[Mr. Tops]

I think the GR-Saginaw trains were Q336 and Q337.

All the info is in my brain, but it has changed so many times, it is hard to spill onto here. It depends what time period you are inquiring about. The best suggestion I can give you is go to http://archive.org/web/web.php and then type in bullsheet.com and pick your date to go back to and look at the train symbols. Pretty cool, actually to see all the symbols that used to run and reminisce seeing those trains.

[trnwatcher]

I know R334/335 (as they where known back on the early 90's) would also work Ensel from time to time. I have video somewhere of R334 setting out a string of cars from the head end of their train. The rest of the train were box cars that where HBO2/3's heading east to be scrapped somewhere. Chased this train east from GR. They met a CP railrunner at Grand Ledge and a empty grain train at Brighton. Last I saw it was heading south around the wye at Plymouth.

[Racer]

Wow Doc, I didn't realize there were trains that worked so many locations in one run, and did it all in one night. Where did all that business go? (rhetorocal question) How come there are less trains here in Michigan today with less places to work, yet they recrew often? What makes D707, Q335, and other trains outlaw so often if they don't work nearly as much as Q336 did?

[SD80MAC]

Wow Doc, I didn't realize there were trains that worked so many locations in one run, and did it all in one night. Where did all that business go? (rhetorocal question) How come there are less trains here in Michigan today with less places to work, yet they recrew often? What makes D707, Q335, and other trains outlaw so often if they don't work nearly as much as Q336 did?

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think track speeds were also higher back then.

[trnwatcher]

Posted speeds may have been, but I remember hearing the guys working the east end complain about the of slow orders that turned a 45mph ROW into 20mph (or slower) for a good deal of the way between Plymouth and GR.

[Saturnalia]

Weren't there also all those CP trackage rights trains to contend with? I remember talking to a CSX engineer who said they would be or be passing by someone at nearly every siding.....

[Jochs]

In the early 1990's, I would go down to St. Joseph to see P370. Usually R337 was waiting in St. Joseph for P370, and sometimes R326 and CP R200 would be right behind them. (Later R trains were changed to Q trains, and, the CP trains were changed to Z then X trains...R200 became Z500 then X500.)
I also remember R337 working at Livingston for a little while, but for the most part, Benton Harbor based D700 worked there, Arlington Metals at Sawyer, Alreco Metals in Benton Harbor (now after becoming Tobin Metals), Comstock Frozen Foods (now APL) and Menasha in Coloma, and interchanged with the KLS&C in Hartford. I think they may have also set cars off at Glenlord Lumber near Stevensville, and Flammco in Stevensville, which got tanks IIRC.
CP added R204 and R205, then R206 and R207 around 1993, and BN began running (again) the West Olive-Cicero Turn, which was N939.

[Saturnalia]

Okay, sorta dumb question time: At their most plentiful point, how manny CP trackage rights trains were there?

[Jochs]

Okay, sorta dumb question time: At their most plentiful point, how manny CP trackage rights trains were there?

We had at least 8 scheduled. R200-R207 at one time. Then there were second sections of some of the trains that often ran. Later, R200 was X500, R202 was X512 if I remember correctly, and R204 became X514. An autorack train, X747 was added. (I saw this train yesterday on NS in Elkhart, IN yesterday as CP147.)

[jrgerber]

One for Doc, this trackboss. Can you shed any light on the schedule from the Grand Ledge branch through Portland and Ionia and who were the customers on this line?

[AveryRdhouse]

Q337 was a good train for a few years in the late 90's on the west end. It was called everyday at 16:00. Power was on and air tested. Had a good time working with Doktor No and another conductor that LOVED to go into Barr Yard and raise the blood pressure of a few trainmasters. Q336 kinda sucked though. Call time was somewhere around midnight. Usually got lots of sleep watching the Conrail parade at Curtis. And for the CP. Miss that to. Train X747, 749, 504, 505, 534, 535 and 544 just in the Blue Island pool.

[jrgerber]

Thanks Doc, yes it was General Tire who before that was known as A O Smith, the customer in Portland was Central Soya I believe I'm shocked to know there was a Chrysler parts plant in Lyons/Muir. I think General Tire closed in 1983 or 1984 one year after the CSX/Grand Trunk line swap.

[AARR]

I believe I'm shocked to know there was a Chrysler parts plant in Lyons/Muir.

The Chrysler parts plant was reached by a short (less than 1 mile) branch off the main. I don't know if there was a passing siding or if they pushed the cars the entire way.

[barnstormer]

Q336 did the setout pickup at Benton Harlem at oh light dawn. Always fun to climb those sandies and take off the handbrakes, lace the hoses, do the inspection, etc, etc.
Yeah we did have some fun back then eh Avery? The car under our train at Cline Ave comes to mind. And reading the latest Chicago division bulletins I see Industrial Blvd is no longer a crossing in service anymore. INTERESTING! I wonder if Clarke Jct is still there or can one pull down to Pine now? That would be nice eh?
Barb the nice Conrail dispatcher. One could count on her for a FEW HOURS nap time at Michigan City or Curtis until her shift was over couldn't we???

Was that the accident where the car ran into one train, then got hit by another, rolling it between the 2 trains, or am I recalling a different story? (seems there have been several accidents at Cline Ave, as I recall)

hehehe, the good ol' Wicked Witch of the West: "Find a place and PARK IT, CSX!!!!". She seemed to have a nack for turning 2-4 railroad mains into a parking lot.

And no, Clark Jct. is still there, although the diamond is gone. The switch for the N.S. single track is still there. Did you ever see any traffic on that diamond, btw?

-barny

[jrgerber]

Doc,

I'm actually from the St Joe Benton Harbor area. What customers did CSX serve in Benton Harbor, St Joe and Stevensville (my actual home town), I recall there was a siding in Stevensville for a foundry. I worked at Auto Specialities in St Joe during my college days. What traffic did Penn Central/Conrail bring into St Joe?

There was actually some talk with the Northstar Steel Plant now in Delta OH was being planned. Benton Harbor and Monroe were the finalists along with Delta. They were talking about actually rebuilding the old Conrail out to Napier avenue to serve the plant.

PS My dad was involved in the land deals for the Elisha Grey park so railroad tracks to put in ie acquiring the houses and the land.

[Saturnalia]

Is Technisand more or less busy these days than in the 90s?

How many cars would the Watervliet Paper Co. go thru in a day?

And was New Buffalo still active as a yard?

[AveryRdhouse]

Technisand was busy on minute and quite the next. Seemed like they got a switch everyday though. I remember CSX stealing BN Macs off a coal train at Grand Junction, and running a HEAVY sand extra to Curtis where a Barr crew got on it. They used a BH crew to do it because the Blue Island pool was depleted.
The paper place in Coloma was on again off again from what I remember. New Buffalo was all storage and HBO's. It was fun to wonder around the yard when you got stuck in the siding for hour's...day's. Neat to see all the old C&O, B&O, WM, and Seaboard crap in there.
Anyone remember the Q327 that took six crews to get it from New Buffalo to Curtis? I was part of that. Get on, eat, sleep, read, sleep, get off and head for the hotel.

[AveryRdhouse]

Watervliet was gone by then.