Grand Elk train question

[GAP]

Last Thursday night I definitely heard a Grand Elk train go southbound thru Portage about 10:30. I' had heard other similar reports but this was the first time I heard the train myself. What train was it at that time? Where was it going? So many questions...

[trnwatcher]

not sure of the number but it was most likely the Grand Rapids to Elkhart job. They leave GR anywhere from 6:30 to about 8:00pm. When I'm at my sisters on Friday's I hear them heading south blowing for 32nd St in Wyoming around 7-7:30ish.

[conrail7695]

What you heard last Thursday night 26 Sept. 2013 was the recrewed 501. GDLK 501 comes on duty at 9am till 7pm and they were recrewed in three river that evening after switch in I.T. in Three river, Michigan. That I.T. is a small old Michigan southern yard, "not much left of it" but there international paper is switched. They usly go dead before or in three rivers. and they send a crew to relive them and the old crew goes to the yard in mill St. Kalamazoo.
The 302 ran after the 501 went north, in a south direction to Elkhart and they come back the next day as of now there train is sitting on the siding on the north side of three rivers. between CP-PARK and CP-COLWING.I live in three rivers and see every thing they do and got my scanner on both of there channels.

Last Thursday night I definitely heard a Grand Elk train go southbound thru Portage about 10:30. I' had heard other similar reports but this was the first time I heard the train myself. What train was it at that time? Where was it going? So many questions...

[Super Chief]

This weekend 302 went north from White Piegon to Three Rivers and tied up at CP PARK at 2:30 pm Friday and sat there all weekend. The crew tied down the handbrakes on the engines and were picked up by a white company pickup truck. Then Saturday morning the train was still there but the engines were gone. I think I heard them tonight at about 6:00 PM talking to WATCO dispatch. I have not checked to see if that was to pickup that train or another movement.

[GAP]

Two Saturdays ago we saw a similar thing. We passed by Park around noon and there were 88 cars setting on the main line (not the siding). No engines were around. The FRED was on the south end so the train had been northbound. When we returned around 6 p.m. the train was still there. Who can explain?

[conrail7695]

Since Grand Elk took over ops. of this line last fall and no long under NS lease, Grand Elk does what they want. Its a very strange animal. 29 Sept. 2013 16:30 Grand Elk crew "303" come over the radio scanner at Anderson's this evening and took two GE'S they were left from a unbound gravel train. They pulled out to mp-14 and got a track warrant to go to "PARK" mp-33 and hook on to the train on the siding there I quoted earlier and took it to Kalamazoo.

[JStryker722]

Wait,GDLK is no longer under an NS lease? I thought they were under a 20 year lease with an option for further years.

[PatAzo]

Friday with 302 went dead at Park. The 303 crew went to Park to grab their power. By the time they got their train ready, waited for Amtrak and then stalled north of Plainwell, the 303 crew went dead at Wayland. Sunday the 303 crew took the rock train power at White Pigeon north to Park to pick up 302 cars left there Friday. They headed to Kalamazoo. The 302 crew was then due to run light to Grand Rapids to pick up the 303 (now in GR), run it to White Pigeon and tack it on the rock train.

Since Grand Elk took over ops. of this line last fall and no long under NS lease, Grand Elk does what they want. Its a very strange animal. 29 Sept. 2013 16:30 Grand Elk crew "303" come over the radio scanner at Anderson's this evening and took two GE'S they were left from a unbound gravel train. They pulled out to mp-14 and got a track warrant to go to "PARK" mp-33 and hook on to the train on the siding there I quoted earlier and took it to Kalamazoo.

[Mike H]

Wait,GDLK is no longer under an NS lease? I thought they were under a 20 year lease with an option for further years.

Yes, the GDLK still leases the line from NS. The only thing that changed is NS was selling the Michigan Line to the statw & Amtrak was going to be taking over the dispatching. With the need for a Michigan Line dispatcher gone it really didn't make sense for them to keep dispatching the GDLK section as well. That leaves only the Kankakee Line on 2nd & 3rd trick needing to be covered which can be fairly easily done.

Mike H

[JStryker722]

Wait,GDLK is no longer under an NS lease? I thought they were under a 20 year lease with an option for further years.

Yes, the GDLK still leases the line from NS. The only thing that changed is NS was selling the Michigan Line to the statw & Amtrak was going to be taking over the dispatching. With the need for a Michigan Line dispatcher gone it really didn't make sense for them to keep dispatching the GDLK section as well. That leaves only the Kankakee Line on 2nd & 3rd trick needing to be covered which can be fairly easily done.

Mike H

I knew GDLK dispatched themselves. Does that mean they are free to as they please on a leased line?

[Mike H]

It doesn't matter if you own or lease a line, you can operate it anyway you want. The only part NS can really dictate is when GDLK goes into Elkhart. I'm not 100% sure, but my understanding was that the original agreement had GDLK going into Elkhart 6 days per week excluding the unit trains.

Mike H

[J T]

A Grand Elk train headed south out of GR at 6am this morning. I didn't see it, but I heard it blowing at every crossing from 28th St. to 68th.

[Super Chief]

Another long northbound thru Three Rivers at 6:00PM tonight. Took it into the siding at Cowling. The crossing lights at North Main didn't activate so they had to stop put fusees out and start into the siding. 4126 and 3531 doing the honors. They will probably sit there all night at CP Park. The switch at Johansens was ready last week to be installed so I wonder if they are getting track time to put that in. The Dove business for Three Rivers fell thru so the 2 million gallon tank won't be here after all. The city and the Route 66 people in TR inked a deal to put more semi trailers on the ole Essex Wire property so the ag business did not get the lease. Lets hope they put it somewhere else on the GDLK. Lots of coil cars on these northbounds and about 15 GATX hoppers with stone on this one tonight. Empty lumber flats for MSO and tank cars for the cleaning people at White Piegon. Any body know the capacity of the siding between CP PARK and Cowling? These trains are taking up 3/4 to 7/8 of that siding of late.

[PatAzo]

Any body know the capacity of the siding between CP PARK and Cowling? These trains are taking up 3/4 to 7/8 of that siding of late.

The Conrail timetable lists it at 9780 feet.

[Super Chief]

Thanks for the siding answer and now the scoop. The FRA took all GDLK's locomotives out of service except for one account of infractions found. The CMO at Hugart must have been busy as they are just now getting more locos out on the road. Hence the weird train times and power assigned, NS locos, 6 &4 axle power on the road train. Maybe 4125 was taken out of service permanent have not seen since. Does WATCO have nearby properties for exchanging locos? The 4126 and 3531 were not at CP PARK this morning but the train was. Just missed 302 going south so did not see power assignment. Maybe it was those two engines running light to Kazoo to get 302 I don't know. Stay tuned.

[JStryker722]

Does WATCO have nearby properties for exchanging locks?

The only close property of any note is the Ann Arbor Railroad. No direct connection. Would have to ship them on NS via Toledo and Elkhart.

[Super Chief]

3829 ran light from either Elkhart or Bristol to CP Park to pull cars tonight. these are the ones sitting there since yesterday. Said he had to pull 15 or 16 back em down the main and then go in the siding and pull some more. Must be he's getting the 501 assignment and will take the cars back south as his radio info indicates he will. So instead of all the cars going to Kazoo they are pulling what they need to form a local in TR. Magic Steel covered coil cars are in the train for northbound pickup but there are uncovered ones too. This has to be an NS yard mistake as I've never seen uncovered coil cars going north since GDLK took over. Things are getting more interesting by the day. Any news on whether they are still staging cars at Gearhart Yard for the Battle Creek customers?

[Jetlink]

On Sunday the Yard at Gearhart has chocked completely full. I don't think you could have fit another car in it.

[Mike H]

I don't have any inside information on this one, but I have a very hard time believing that anyone is staging cars in Kalamazoo for the customers between there & Battle Creek. Where did this rumore come from? Customers don't just stage cars for the heck of it & demurrage gives the customer an incentive to get cars moving as quickly as possible again. Many products cannot sit in a car extended periods of time, plus someone has to pay for the cost of the car. Just using round numbers most customers lease cars for around $600 per month depending on commodity, size, age, car type & a few other factors.

When switching in Gerhart Yard its hard to use less than7 tracks unless you have a small train to switch out, so by the time you take into account the storage cars in 7-10 track (assuming they are still there) it doesn't leave any extra room for just sitting on cars to go to Battle Creek or Augusta. Plus there has been no STB filing & I believe there needs to be at least a 30 day approval process. No customer is going to sit on assets like that for such a long time frame.

Mike H

[AARR]

Where did this rumore come from?

Us railfans don't need anything substantial to start a rumor Most rumors start in our heads